Idea challange

[phantom]

This is going to be very long

So, take this entire Universe. Its completely meaningless. Like there were no specific meaning set for things. Earth just happened to be in a Goldilock Zone, which just happened to be suitable for life to grow.

But, exactly due to this meaningless state, humans had 2 obsessions. 1 is, to create meaning in this meaningless place. They created thousands of meaning in everything they could and these meanings changed over time. Now there was no problem with this.

Problem came with the 2nd obsession, which is to make sure that the meaning they had created is the correct one. Cuz the problem is, what would you consider as the correct one? Is it longer survival? Happier days? Wealthy life? Each have their own set of values, which were created by themselves and their surroundings. The more one wants to be correct, the more complex life becomes.

Lets take an a govt employee and an artist. Those who want stability, regardless of their own wishes, would support the former. Those who pursue independence and passion would stand with the latter. Now, the govt guy wouldn't like the artist as he might be seen as more responsible. but deep down, he might also be jelaous of the freedom than an artist might have. The artist might hate the govt cuz he might seem him as a person who doesnt have a will of their own and just follows the "default script". but the artist cries when he sees the govt guy enjoying spending his money.

now the above is only based on the role. the complexity branches out on who plays it. its different for men and women. different when your family refuses or supports your decision. different when you are talented and not talented. different skin. different height, weight, language, region, religion, etc.

point is, ppl focus too much on who's right and when things dont go their way, they immediaetely try to justify by saying things like "i am a man so what i say is right" or "my religion never lies so i am correct" or "i am older than you so i am right" and even stuff like "i have (insert premium product) which you dont have, so, you are wrong" and it gets worse enough that ppl would be willing to kill someone just bcz he had a different problem or a solution or even a opinion.

now, you would have you have to be the Vishnu/Jesus/Messiah/Buddha to have the ability for accepting someone who has exactly opposite values. But tolerance? Tolerance can be learnt

Like the govt guy saying to artist "i don't like how you are wasting the money your parents used for developing you. But i'm not gonna correct you for it".

maybe not the last but you get the idea. why cant ppl refrain themselves from correcting someone who's different? like i genuinely dont understand. are they afraid of losing their values? afraid of losing the identity that values gave? but if its theirs, why are they afraid? is it even theirs to begin with?

but! it doesnt mean that every single behaviour either. like you can't accept a psychopath who likes to torture and kill ppl. this is just one example and there are more cases

regardless world would suck a bit less if ppl were more tolerant of each other

 

[Serpent]

I'll go one by one, so buckle up

So, take this entire Universe. Its completely meaningless. Like there were no specific meaning set for things. Earth just happened to be in a Goldilock Zone, which just happened to be suitable for life to grow.

False. There have been other places found, and have been scientifically proven, to be habitable, meaning that they could sustain life. And if that is the case, who's to say that there is no life on them already?
And also, whether it's meaningless or not, depends on the individual, and their beliefs mostly.

But, exactly due to this meaningless state, humans had 2 obsessions. 1 is, to create meaning in this meaningless place. They created thousands of meaning in everything they could and these meanings changed over time. Now there was no problem with this.

I suppose I agree, though I wouldn't even say that they had two, only one obsession, or rather one thing that is driving them. And creating meaning could be that one, but then you have others who have found the meaning, at least for them, and so on and so forth...

Problem came with the 2nd obsession, which is to make sure that the meaning they had created is the correct one. Cuz the problem is, what would you consider as the correct one? Is it longer survival? Happier days? Wealthy life? Each have their own set of values, which were created by themselves and their surroundings. The more one wants to be correct, the more complex life becomes.

This is, I'd say, false. Why would anyone have an obsession with it? Sure, people like to correct others, but I don't think it comes from the obsession that they are ultimately right, but I think that it's about something that is deeper, that only smarter people think about, while the dumber ones don't. And that's to find what the actual truth is.
That's how science improves, and that's normal for people. To continuously learn, and always evolve accordingly.

Lets take an a govt employee and an artist. Those who want stability, regardless of their own wishes, would support the former. Those who pursue independence and passion would stand with the latter. Now, the govt guy wouldn't like the artist as he might be seen as more responsible. but deep down, he might also be jelaous of the freedom than an artist might have. The artist might hate the govt cuz he might seem him as a person who doesnt have a will of their own and just follows the "default script". but the artist cries when he sees the govt guy enjoying spending his money.

now the above is only based on the role. the complexity branches out on who plays it. its different for men and women. different when your family refuses or supports your decision. different when you are talented and not talented. different skin. different height, weight, language, region, religion, etc.

point is, ppl focus too much on who's right and when things dont go their way, they immediaetely try to justify by saying things like "i am a man so what i say is right" or "my religion never lies so i am correct" or "i am older than you so i am right" and even stuff like "i have (insert premium product) which you dont have, so, you are wrong" and it gets worse enough that ppl would be willing to kill someone just bcz he had a different problem or a solution or even a opinion.

What you gave as an example is a fairly simple example, and while it is true, I don't think it proves your point that well. At least not the govt worker and artist one.
Because both of those could be looked from many angles, not just the one you pointed out. For instance, let's say that artist is happy with having little, as long as he has enough to pass by and do what he loves. He wouldn't look at the govt guy spending money. I think you can get the idea what I'm going with here.

And the other example that you've given shows dumb, closed minded people. They are just that, low iq individuals who are limited, and as such can't be considered as an example in a complex thought/view as you offered for this whole text.

now, you would have you have to be the Vishnu/Jesus/Messiah/Buddha to have the ability for accepting someone who has exactly opposite values. But tolerance? Tolerance can be learnt

No you wouldn't. You can just have an open mind, and understand that there may be more than one correct answer.
The problem is that people only assume that there is one right, when there are multiple rights. The example could be the fact that it is raining here where I live currently, and so if I say that it is raining outside, that's the truth. But from where you are, it could be sunny, so if you were to say that it's sunny outside, you would also be correct.
Same goes for more complex things. I may not agree with you on religion, and may even think a complete opposite of what you think about it, but I can respect you as a person.
I love that one saying that L usually uses. A quote from some guy he told me, which goes that I don't have to agree with you to like you or respect you. I don't know who said that, since I forgot the name L told me
Then again, one has to be open minded and smart enough to understand that. You can't expect that from dumb individuals.

Like the govt guy saying to artist "i don't like how you are wasting the money your parents used for developing you. But i'm not gonna correct you for it".

maybe not the last but you get the idea. why cant ppl refrain themselves from correcting someone who's different? like i genuinely dont understand. are they afraid of losing their values? afraid of losing the identity that values gave? but if its theirs, why are they afraid? is it even theirs to begin with?

but! it doesnt mean that every single behaviour either. like you can't accept a psychopath who likes to torture and kill ppl. this is just one example and there are more cases

regardless world would suck a bit less if ppl were more tolerant of each other

They can refrain. But they need to be smart.
Again, dumb individuals work differently. Take a look outside, and you'll see that the dumb ones all dress the same, talk the same, act the same, because it's a pack mentality.
Look at the smart ones, the outcasts, rebels, whatever. They are all different, and they would never tell anyone anything, unless it's something that's, quite frankly, insane.
Also, I'd like to point out that this doesn't work for extremes. Just how you mentioned psychopaths and their tendencies.

Now, would it suck less? I mean, I highly doubt that. I think it would be the same, just a different version of it. But, I can't say, since I'd have to live in that world to know for sure

This was fun!

 

[phantom]

False. There have been other places found, and have been scientifically proven, to be habitable, meaning that they could sustain life. And if that is the case, who's to say that there is no life on them already?
And also, whether it's meaningless or not, depends on the individual, and their beliefs mostly.

wait really? life outside of the goldilock zone? is ot found deep underground ground or something? cuz of the absence of atmosphere?

What you gave as an example is a fairly simple example, and while it is true, I don't think it proves your point that well. At least not the govt worker and artist one.
Because both of those could be looked from many angles, not just the one you pointed out. For instance, let's say that artist is happy with having little, as long as he has enough to pass by and do what he loves. He wouldn't look at the govt guy spending money. I think you can get the idea what I'm going with here.

And the other example that you've given shows dumb, closed minded people. They are just that, low iq individuals who are limited, and as such can't be considered as an example in a complex thought/view as you offered for this whole text.

never accounted ppl with closed mind. the example i offered is simple cuz i was too lazy to give a fitting one. my brain got fried with all of those thinking and putting them into words

No you wouldn't. You can just have an open mind, and understand that there may be more than one correct answer.
The problem is that people only assume that there is one right, when there are multiple rights. The example could be the fact that it is raining here where I live currently, and so if I say that it is raining outside, that's the truth. But from where you are, it could be sunny, so if you were to say that it's sunny outside, you would also be correct.
Same goes for more complex things. I may not agree with you on religion, and may even think a complete opposite of what you think about it, but I can respect you as a person.
I love that one saying that L usually uses. A quote from some guy he told me, which goes that I don't have to agree with you to like you or respect you. I don't know who said that, since I forgot the name L told me
Then again, one has to be open minded and smart enough to understand that. You can't expect that from dumb individuals.

again. i only thought as ppl and not smart and dumb. it makes sense though. L's quote was actually what made me thinking in the 1st place. and instagram, obviously. the negativity there is enough to imprison someone in depression. or maybe its just my feed. but i cleansed it with sea mantees.

They can refrain. But they need to be smart.
Again, dumb individuals work differently. Take a look outside, and you'll see that the dumb ones all dress the same, talk the same, act the same, because it's a pack mentality.

i wouldnt call every single one as dumb. cuz that pack mentality is what has helped ppl survive sometimes. not enough to live as they wished but just enough that they could survive. or maybe, just following the pack might be the easiest way to survive. ppl like easy ways

 

[Serpent]

wait really? life outside of the goldilock zone? is ot found deep underground ground or something? cuz of the absence of atmosphere?

Usually the water planets, and places like that. But yeah, there were a few places that they discovered that could potentially have life on them.

never accounted ppl with closed mind. the example i offered is simple cuz i was too lazy to give a fitting one. my brain got fried with all of those thinking and putting them into words

I feel ya. But since the question, and idea behind what you talked about, is a complex one, I had to include a bit more details into my responses. Because a complex idea can't be compared with simplicity, since many factors need to be accounted for.

again. i only thought as ppl and not smart and dumb

I get you, but people as in just people can't be a viable thing. Because no one is just a human being, and they all act differently, depending on this or that.

L's quote was actually what made me thinking in the 1st place. and instagram, obviously. the negativity there is enough to imprison someone in depression. or maybe its just my feed. but i cleansed it with sea mantees.

Yeah, but if ya ask me, there is hate everywhere, sometimes justified, sometimes not. But honestly, the best way is to just ignore it all, and feed cleanse as you did, and only focus on yourself and people you care about.
At least that's what I do

i wouldnt call every single one as dumb. cuz that pack mentality is what has helped ppl survive sometimes. not enough to live as they wished but just enough that they could survive. or maybe, just following the pack might be the easiest way to survive. ppl like easy ways

I would because no smart person would just follow mindlessly like that. I get using the pack to achieve your goals, but that is a whoooole other thing.
And sure, while it has its advantages, it also has its disadvantages. Perfect example would be to be tolerable.
What the main in the group decides, or the idol, or whatever, that's what goes. If it's in to hate on everyone and everything, guess what happens.
Though I must agree, following the pack is a very easy way to go by, true. And people do like easy, but that just leaves to never being satisfied with yourself, since you and your life are dependent on trends and whatnot, and not your personal expression. Which is very bad way to live, if you ask me

 

[phantom]

Which is very bad way to live, if you ask me

a bad way, but nonethless, a way cuz in the end, all ppl wanna do is survive.

survival is both objective & subjective at the same time. survival is basically trying not to die. thats the objective part. but how they survive and why they survive and is their survival even worth, all is subjective

 

[Serpent]

a bad way, but nonethless, a way cuz in the end, all ppl wanna do is survive.

survival is both objective & subjective at the same time. survival is basically trying not to die. thats the objective part. but how they survive and why they survive and is their survival even worth, all is subjective

True, but this claim contradicts your point. Just wanting to survive is not being tolerant. Anyone who is different, anyone who doesn't belong, anyone whatever is then at risk, because for survival, you only look after yourself and no one else, ensuring your own survival, and if that means following the bigger crowd (not tolerant ones), then that is how it's going to be.
The reason why I say that the majority is not tolerant, is because that's simply how it is, and anyone sticking out of that norm is labeled different and not welcomed by them.
Survival is adaptability, and that is not tolerant, rather contorting to whatever it is needed

 

[phantom]

True, but this claim contradicts your point. Just wanting to survive is not being tolerant. Anyone who is different, anyone who doesn't belong, anyone whatever is then at risk, because for survival, you only look after yourself and no one else, ensuring your own survival, and if that means following the bigger crowd (not tolerant ones), then that is how it's going to be.
The reason why I say that the majority is not tolerant, is because that's simply how it is, and anyone sticking out of that norm is labeled different and not welcomed by them.
Survival is adaptability, and that is not tolerant, rather contorting to whatever it is needed

a contradiction huh. I wonder if humans ever learn or better, evolve, to be tolerant and consider the survival of others. though i can only wonder

 

[Serpent]

a contradiction huh. I wonder if humans ever learn or better, evolve, to be tolerant and consider the survival of others. though i can only wonder

You can't really "evolve" into that, rather you can just learn, and better yourself. Choosing not to be an *******, instead of being one type of thing. But, it is all a very complex subject, because there is a bunch of details that need to be considered in order to give a good enough of an answer, but to put it simply, yes, some do learn, but I'm afraid that the majority doesn't. It's just how things currently are